Post by Galaxy on Jul 27, 2015 9:06:56 GMT 1
I wanted to give a small update on the latest situation with us playing HOTS.
We tried setting up TL and we tried setting up groups for HL.
It didn't work out.
I want to explain why that is.
Hero / Team League - Why is it not kicking off as we thought ?
There are 4 problems I see.
1. First of all, HL is not the system I thought it would be.
You do not meet better players when reaching rank 20, 10 or 1. I eyefrowned myself by not noticing much difference once I had rank 9. For example, people in the draft still had not clue how to counter-pick. They pick an Illidan ? Ok then I'll play Uther. kinda-mindsets are simply near non-existant.
What is the real situation then ? That people simply play the heroes they feel like wanting to play. A mistake I have often made as well but you learn after a while it works against the team. In HL people don't care about counter-picking, either because they don't know what is a good counter-pick (which is ofc normal since that is game knowledge you only get by experience), but more often because they can't play the hero or don't feel like playing it (eg because they are not good at it). For example, if I see an Abathur being picked by the enemy team it is my job to my own team to show I can play Rehgar, Illidan, Uther, Tyrande, Arthas, Nova/Zera etc in prepick to prevent our team not building towards a balanced draft.
As a result HL draft picking is a nightmare often. You see the best team comps fail because of bad play. And you see the worst comps fail because of bad play. The only times I saw good matches where when people were a) aware of how map objectives worked b) the group followed a leader c) good communication flow d) all 5 played a hero they were really good at e) constantly involved their map awareness to react faster.
That scenario was like 1 out of 20 times.
And now comes the funny part: everything I just said applied to all of us albeit in different degrees.
2. The second problem for setting up HL/TL is player availability.
Almost none of us are online regularly. That means practising with each other is also very difficult, in fact, it's impossible. You need to have players attuned to each others communication. If you play as a team, you need a leader period. And if he/she is not being listened to immediately, or not receiving feedback properly, the team has a big issue. I've noticed that a lot when mixing with other players, each had its own idea of how to play and are stubbornly doing their thing and it goes to shit.
I played a lot with Dalamar and Shana. Recently we got paired with a 4th player called Kaethgar, which is a really good player and easily synergises when playing with us. We noticed such synergies in the past already with people like Hammer. But more often we noticed there is no synergy. And so we come the third problem I've noticed.
3. Most of us suck at damage role
Now I'm not talking only about heroes that are "Ranged Carry/DPS" like Valla/Falstad/etc.
Nor am I exclusively talking about Illidan/Butcher/etc.
Nor am I restricting it to Nazeebo/Sylvanas/etc.
Nor am I forgetting Tyrael/Johanna/etc (yeah they do damage)
People have some heroes they play really really well and others they simply suck at. That doesn't just mean "knowing how to burst". It more often means "knowing how to position your hero". For example, damage wise I suck at Jaina or Khaelthas or Valla simply because they are high prio targets and their positioning requires an thinking mindset that I don't really have atm, but I don't suck with Sylvanas, Nazeebo or Butcher because their positioning mindset works better for me even though the same oppurtunistic/stay-safe combo applies. I don't know exactly why they suit me better. I just know they do. Also keep retrying after a while since I've noticed having more game experience changes your hero play and adaptation.
So know what damage hero suits you.
A hero that doesn't feel like its an extension of how you think is the wrong hero to play for you at that moment.
The best proof of me knowing most of us suck at damage is by noticing the difference when I stay in the same role as tank.
4. Team League still viable for us ?
No.
Dalamar.
Shana.
Galaxy.
Kaethgar.
Those 4 players are currently the ones playing regularly together for competitive play and looking for a 5th at least. The word "competitive" simply means a) not accepting from yourself you screw up and admitting your own mistakes b) being online regularly c) being good at the role you play d) being good at the map you play.
Essentially constantly trying to improve game fundamentals.
Something I haven't elaborated on but also strategy knowledge on most of us sucks. The amount of times I saw people not going to mid when dragon shrine for enemy is up I cannot count. Or the amount of times I see people taking merc camps at the wrong times is horrible (Sky Temple before bot temple phase being the prime example). Its ok to suck. Its not ok to not admit it. You don't learn if you keep thinking the rest sucks but you don't.
Team fighting is another aspect that is really though and requires good hero synergy, good dps players, good callouts and communication, good positioning, etc its really daunting but you need to practice it with the same people.
So yes we need fixed players.
For that reason I'm thinking of disbanding the current Insignia Zero team since it has no purpose right now and re-creating it once we have a team.
All that being said... I do have a life outside this game as well
We tried setting up TL and we tried setting up groups for HL.
It didn't work out.
I want to explain why that is.
Hero / Team League - Why is it not kicking off as we thought ?
There are 4 problems I see.
1. First of all, HL is not the system I thought it would be.
You do not meet better players when reaching rank 20, 10 or 1. I eyefrowned myself by not noticing much difference once I had rank 9. For example, people in the draft still had not clue how to counter-pick. They pick an Illidan ? Ok then I'll play Uther. kinda-mindsets are simply near non-existant.
What is the real situation then ? That people simply play the heroes they feel like wanting to play. A mistake I have often made as well but you learn after a while it works against the team. In HL people don't care about counter-picking, either because they don't know what is a good counter-pick (which is ofc normal since that is game knowledge you only get by experience), but more often because they can't play the hero or don't feel like playing it (eg because they are not good at it). For example, if I see an Abathur being picked by the enemy team it is my job to my own team to show I can play Rehgar, Illidan, Uther, Tyrande, Arthas, Nova/Zera etc in prepick to prevent our team not building towards a balanced draft.
As a result HL draft picking is a nightmare often. You see the best team comps fail because of bad play. And you see the worst comps fail because of bad play. The only times I saw good matches where when people were a) aware of how map objectives worked b) the group followed a leader c) good communication flow d) all 5 played a hero they were really good at e) constantly involved their map awareness to react faster.
That scenario was like 1 out of 20 times.
And now comes the funny part: everything I just said applied to all of us albeit in different degrees.
2. The second problem for setting up HL/TL is player availability.
Almost none of us are online regularly. That means practising with each other is also very difficult, in fact, it's impossible. You need to have players attuned to each others communication. If you play as a team, you need a leader period. And if he/she is not being listened to immediately, or not receiving feedback properly, the team has a big issue. I've noticed that a lot when mixing with other players, each had its own idea of how to play and are stubbornly doing their thing and it goes to shit.
I played a lot with Dalamar and Shana. Recently we got paired with a 4th player called Kaethgar, which is a really good player and easily synergises when playing with us. We noticed such synergies in the past already with people like Hammer. But more often we noticed there is no synergy. And so we come the third problem I've noticed.
3. Most of us suck at damage role
Now I'm not talking only about heroes that are "Ranged Carry/DPS" like Valla/Falstad/etc.
Nor am I exclusively talking about Illidan/Butcher/etc.
Nor am I restricting it to Nazeebo/Sylvanas/etc.
Nor am I forgetting Tyrael/Johanna/etc (yeah they do damage)
People have some heroes they play really really well and others they simply suck at. That doesn't just mean "knowing how to burst". It more often means "knowing how to position your hero". For example, damage wise I suck at Jaina or Khaelthas or Valla simply because they are high prio targets and their positioning requires an thinking mindset that I don't really have atm, but I don't suck with Sylvanas, Nazeebo or Butcher because their positioning mindset works better for me even though the same oppurtunistic/stay-safe combo applies. I don't know exactly why they suit me better. I just know they do. Also keep retrying after a while since I've noticed having more game experience changes your hero play and adaptation.
So know what damage hero suits you.
A hero that doesn't feel like its an extension of how you think is the wrong hero to play for you at that moment.
The best proof of me knowing most of us suck at damage is by noticing the difference when I stay in the same role as tank.
4. Team League still viable for us ?
No.
Dalamar.
Shana.
Galaxy.
Kaethgar.
Those 4 players are currently the ones playing regularly together for competitive play and looking for a 5th at least. The word "competitive" simply means a) not accepting from yourself you screw up and admitting your own mistakes b) being online regularly c) being good at the role you play d) being good at the map you play.
Essentially constantly trying to improve game fundamentals.
Something I haven't elaborated on but also strategy knowledge on most of us sucks. The amount of times I saw people not going to mid when dragon shrine for enemy is up I cannot count. Or the amount of times I see people taking merc camps at the wrong times is horrible (Sky Temple before bot temple phase being the prime example). Its ok to suck. Its not ok to not admit it. You don't learn if you keep thinking the rest sucks but you don't.
Team fighting is another aspect that is really though and requires good hero synergy, good dps players, good callouts and communication, good positioning, etc its really daunting but you need to practice it with the same people.
So yes we need fixed players.
For that reason I'm thinking of disbanding the current Insignia Zero team since it has no purpose right now and re-creating it once we have a team.
All that being said... I do have a life outside this game as well
